Hangar Talk

[spleisher]

All,

I just copied this post of mine from the thread about the crash...I have some thoughts.. based on what Mark was saying as well as Barb and Allen's responses... What do you think of this?????


Here are my thoughts... I still think it would be nice to have a "pilot" corner or something like that. It would be a forum where us pilots can get together and talk some hangar talk and technical airplane stuff. There are a number of us here, and it is indeed difficult to completely avoid digressing into "pilot talk" every now and again.

Still, I believe that some pilot talk is good in the general forums. I know for me it helped to come to grips with the technical side of flight. There are undoubttedly other FoF'ers of there who feel the same way. There are also, however, people who do not care about the technical, and benefit more from a BASIC understanding coupled with coping mechanisms and all the other tools at their disposal.

I think the job of us "helpers" is to give the "helpees" the whole picture. Allen, I think it is a great idea to mix the jargon with "plane" talk! But I do think there should be some sort of "Pilot Hangar" as well.

It could be a place where us lesser Pilots can ask the Rays and Bobs and Royds of the world technical questions. I think we all become better Pilots and better helpers to those who have a FoF by sharing the technical side of it. And if the people who don't really care that much about the technical want to come in and have a look, that would be great too!! I think people really benefit from seeing how passionate pilots are about their hobbies and/or professions!

But we don'ty want this to degenerate into a Pilot forum either.

What do you guys think"?

Scott

[spleisher]

Oh and I want to add.. This forum is awesome!!! The group of people here are really top notch and I am thrilled to be a part of this!!!!

[lieberma]

But we don'ty want this to degenerate into a Pilot forum either.

Scott,

I think you hit the nail on the head. I don't think you meant the word "degenerate" in it's full meaning, but I think most understood.

As you already have been pointed to www.thepilotlounge.com, for the real technical talk, I think it would be best to converse there to comment on technique of flying in the techy talk.

I would doubt that the FOF passenger seated in 6F of a 747, or a FOF passenger sitting in the right seat of a Cessna 152 would really care if we crabbed, slipped, shot VOR/DME approaches and so on.

I would think that the FOF passengers do appreciate pilots sharing our knowledge in a user friendly forum and I would hope we can bring down that fear factor a notch or two by sharing our passion in a user friendly format.

Allen

[CaptainStark]

I am still confised....

Does that mean it's good when I call it the "radar ony-offy button" or the "flappy-doodle handle" or the "rudder actuator thangamajig?"

Or is it bad? I want to go about this isn the right way!


Ray (the confused):ray

[spleisher]

I'm a little confused too. Maybe we're making too big a deal of it. The bottom line is we want to offer teh fearful flyer a good place to get comfort and information about airplanes. Maybe a little hangar talk is a good thing as it gives them insight into the world of pilots. I know when I was afraid to fly, that was what got me through.... getting to know pilots and what they do. The function of this board, I think, is different for everybody. Heck, that's why anybody can start any type of thread they want at any time.

Liek Barb said, the threads have a way of taking on a life of their own, and that is hard to manage. I don't know that we should really try to manage that. We may run the risk of killing the essence of the forum. Having said that, a little re-direction back to the original question may occasionally be in order.

The only reason I mentioned the "Pilot Corner" idea was it would be a place for the Pilot members of this FoF community to ask questions that are SPECIFIC to other pilots.... ie. the thread we have going in Ray's forum about easing back pressure at the end of the flare on large planes. Cool stuff, but very pilot-specific.

I suppose we can keep things the way they are and just use Ray's forum for those questions that come from "other pilots". By the way Ray, I for one really appreciate you taking the time to answer the pilot questions. I LOVE those threads, and I have found a few nuggets in there that I believe will actually make me a better, safer pilot!!!

Sorry if I created any confusion... I just wqas thinking of a way that we could ask pilot-to-pilot questions without overwhelming the other FoF board folks.

Talk to you all soon. Until then, may the wind be at your tail and all your turns be well-coordinated.

(And for all you non-pilots, a "coordinated turn" is performed by using both rudder and aileron at the same time with the correct amount of each)

Rudder - AKA "Crabbymadoodle" and....

Aileron - AKA "turneyhelpythingamajigger"

Later all,
Scott

[Disney fan]

Ok,

From the perspective of a Fearful flyer I am quite happy to listen to your pilot tech terms! I may ask for explanations if I don't understand.

I am quite able and happy to learn new terminology . To be honest I don't care if you use a tech term or call it a thingumigig as long as I know what the thingumigig is!

We all use techy terms in our jobs .I as a nurse and Midwife have perhaps used them too often but as long as you are willing to explain anything you have said there is no problem.

[MarcoAviator]

I am going to try to "interpret" Mark's policy here (and I may be wrong, so feel free to slap me if I am).

I think that Mark wants this forum to be dedicated and focused on fear of flying and all members (including pilots) can discuss about FOF from the perspective of passengers or pilots (or both, in my case).

I am grateful for this "specialization" so to speak, since as a Fearful Flyer I, myself was never able to find such a great forum on the subject. This is indeed the best FOF forum out there. I was never able to read so much about people that share incredibly similar feelings about flying (on both sides of the cockpit door).

I wish I had found this forum earlier. Just chatting with Ray helped me a lot.

As a fearful flyer, I can say that aviation tech talk targeted at improving FOF or making aviation less of a mystery for FOF-ers is great. It belongs here. (granted that my questions to Ray were over the deep end as far as technicalities go, but they helped me).

As for the aviation discussion, as I said before there's my forum but there's others too. I don't necessarily want to promote my forum (I am happy if you join but that's not why I am here ... i am here because I am scared out of my mind everytime I board a plane). But I can see how "exclusive" pilot talk might not belong in here. Occasionally, threads will have a life of their own (as Scott, said). Nothing wrong with that. Yet, the focus here is Fear of Flying.

Same as Fear of Flying does not belong in my forum (which is instead General Aviation and Flight Training). I don't do anything to disallow FOF talk, (again, thread take a life of their own) and it's mentioned occasionally but it's just not the focus of my forum and I won't encourage it.

I think that's what Mark intended.

Just my 2c, and as I said, I may be wrong.

[Chelle]

just another opinion from the peanut gallery :dancers

I’m actually comforted by being in the midst of so many skilled and knowledgeable people, I’m grateful for all the industry folks we have here with us. Otherwise we would be a group of fearful flyers “flying blind”, with no advice or guidance :)

Knowledge is power. Avoiding facts about aviation is denial. I think knowing everything we can about aircraft (and even crashes, when they occur) will aid in our understanding, and ultimately in overcoming our fears. Since joining this group I have learned that pilots are indeed people! With lives, and families, and they’re really very nice. As opposed to the mental image I had of rigid bots flying these planes aimlessly, lol. Sure, depending on the person (like me :D ) too much knowledge can lead to obsessing. But, I’m a big girl, I know my limits, and if I see a discussion take a turn I’m not comfortable with, I have the power and ability to hit the back button.

As for the ‘jargon’, I’m with Lynda... as long as I know what it is you’re referring to, it doesn’t matter to me. I appreciate Ray’s cutesy terms, LOL. He explained to me about lightening, and the purpose of the “static wick thingies” on the back of the plane. Now when I see them, I know what they are. They’re static wick thingies. They will always be static wick thingies to me. I’m sure there’s a more technical term for them, but that’s okay. I’m an accountant, I have no need to learn every technical aviation term :D

Our community is still very new, and we’re defining who we are and what kind of group we want to be. And that’s great! We need to do that. But I don’t think we should discourage the pilots among us from talking freely in any way.

[spleisher]

I appreciate that Chelle. I agree. I really don't think there's a true problem here. See my post on "Non FoF topics"

I think we need to encourage everyone to be open, and we need to embrace the expert, as well as the reformed and not yet reformed fearful flyers. In the end, that's what's going to make us a strong and cohesive community.

I think what Mark is getting at is we just want to make sure everybody is feeling like they can participate, and that everyine is gaining as much help as they can from the forum.

[Chelle]

I noticed your more recent post after I posted :blush

And don't worry, if the pilots go off on their own little tangent in a thread, we can tell them to 'get a room' :lol

[spleisher]

The thing is.. for pilots, hangar talk is FUN. The one thing we like doing almost as much as flying airplanes is... TALKKING ABOUT THEM!!!! :happyguy

[MarcoAviator]

The thing is.. for pilots, hangar talk is FUN. The one thing we like doing almost as much as flying airplanes is... TALKKING ABOUT THEM!!!! :happyguy

:happyguy :hyped :happyguy :hyped :happyguy :hyped

:D

[xiknal]

or...in the case of students' bad landings, I would much rather hangar-talk about them :rotflmao than ride through them :jawdrop ...but the best thing of all is turning them loose to solo after they've learned to do good landings :thumbsup .

"Courage is the price that life exacts for granting peace" as Amelia said.

The feedback we are getting from our nonpilots suggests that they enjoy sitting in on the hangar talk insofar as it is accessible, and not arrogant or intimidating. Certainly none of us would want it to seem that way!! Decoding jargon will make it accessible...so maybe techish posts could have a little glossary at the end for all the alphabet soup, etc. such as:

ILS Instrument Landing System: a guidance system that allows a plane in the clouds to line up with the runway centerline and descend on a precise glide path.

VASI Visual Approach Slope Indicator: a set of red and white lights that indicate visually to an approaching aircraft whether it is on the proper glide path, or too high or too low.

DME Distance Measuring Equipment: a type of navigation radio receiver which tells the pilot such things as distance from a certain station, groundspeed, and time to reach the station.

PIO Pilot Induced Oscillations: what student pilots tend to do when overcorrecting for a crosswind on final.

LBT Little Black Things (in fuel tester): um, if you see 'em, keep testing till they go away.

CFI Certificated Flight Instructor: the most dangerous job in the world until we figger out what the throttle is really for.

FAA ...ahem, we're from it and we're here to help you.

and, if that isn't enough already, here's a song I wrote back in 1996 bemoaning the angst of having to learn all this...stuff... :cry

*********

CFI Wannabe Blues
words and music (c) by Barb MacLeod

I like to talk, I love to fly;
I wanna be a CFI,
But look at all this weird and stressful stuff I'd have to know;
I'd have to find the ELT,
Get certified for IMC,
And learn to live on sunlight, beans, and ego.

I'd have to strap in on the right;
The thought alone makes me uptight;
The six-pack and the master switch would be way over there;
I'd have spontaneous attacks
Of mirror-image parallax;
I might not find the centerline, might land it in the air.

I'd have to learn psychology,
And know the regs so thoroughly,
Have an E6B computer chip implanted in my head;
I'd have to squirm and climb the walls
While watching students practice stalls,
And fly when I would rather be in bed.

But all my friends will think I'm cool,
When I get hired by a prestigious Part 141 flight school;
I'll soon be flying jets and having money rolling in;
But now I gotta think this through;
There's all this stressful stuff to do,
And before I take that checkride I'm gonna have to do a
spin!

And so to be a CFI, I gotta learn to set the CDI,
Read the DME, track an NDB, do a hold in a TCA;
Oops, I meant to say `Class B';
There's so doggone much to know, you see;
That's why I've got the blues on such a sunny day.

(glossary on request) ;)

[xiknal]

there are mysterious things on airplanes that not even the pilots understand.

I will post about this on Ray's board under the title "The Little Middle Thingie".

0]

[WillFlyToDisney2]

My vote is for anything that keeps the pilots happy on this board. The more pilots the merrier! :ray :ray :ray :ray :ray :ray

Actually I also agree that I would LOVE to learn more about the technical side of flying - and reading the "pilot talk" would surely help that as long as you guys don't mind a dumb question from time to time from the non-pilots like myself. Knowledge is power!

Kelley

[Passenger Mark]

Based on the responses... keep the education coming....

Just do me a favor... please....please... dont throw anything at me...:duck

For my brain... keep them a bit brief, some of these long posts have my eyes and brain going crossways! :crazy

[spleisher]

Yeah.. it does kinda seem like the word on the street is that folks want to be educated as much as possible, so I guess noone seems to mind a little techno-babble. I'll try not to go overboard. :)