Question about flight pattern

[CAflyer]

I have been tracking flights ( some for friends , some times the flight I will be taking to see if it has been on time and what route it will take) anyways... I am tracking Frontier from DEN to PHL and they are about 160 mi from the destination and I noticed their speed dropped all the way down to 170 and their altitude went as far down as 25000 and they circle a few times ( the line/plane icon went around in a circle a few times on two different tracking sites) now the plane is going strait again and the speed picked back up to 400. Why would they do this? I would think if it were a holding pattern it would be closer to the airport. Just want to know if this seems weird to you. I tracked on Flight stats and Flight aware and both showed this pattern.

[Captain Hutch]

Hi CAflyer,

If the numbers are correct, it looks like they were in a holding pattern at 25,000 feet. Since aircraft are required to slow to a maximum airspeed in a holding pattern (so as to stay within the controller's specified airspace), a 170 knot ground speed wouldn't be that unusual with a 50 or 60 knot headwind at that altitude. Of course, correspondingly so, the downwind portion of the pattern would be that much faster. Though it is more common to be put into a holding pattern close to the airport, it is not unusual to "take a turn or two" in a holding pattern at some distance from the airport.

So, no, to answer your question, the situation you described is not uncommon or unusual.

I think that's cool that you track all of those flights!

Thanks,

Hutch :tiphat:

[Barb-SAN]

Heh...I missed this question when it was first posted. Ironically, when I was tracking CAflyer's flight, I came across an example of a holding pattern on FBOWeb/Google Earth (from the previous day's track), and posted a screen shot of it, linked here on the tracking forum (a good ways down the page): http://www.takingflight.us/forums/showthread.php?t=8234

If anyone wants to take the time to do it, you could look up that flight on Flight Aware, then go to "Track Log", and find the minute to minute details (speed and altitude) of that holding pattern.

[CAflyer]

Yeah it was a good idea to track the flights, it made me feel less anxious because I saw the same flights taking place everyday. I really loved the Frontier TVs and the free tracking map. It is interesting to see what landmarks you are over and then you can look out the window and see it live. Also it was good to be able to see the speed and alt.
On our last flight into LAX right after take off and we started to level off the plane made a noticeable change in speed, even the flight attendant said "Woah" ( she was very outgoing and talked a lot). I watched her after she said that and she just went on about her business. It's funny how our bodies really are so sensitive to changes and even the people that fly a lot notice them. It really helped to have that map and be able to see that we were still moving along safe and sound even in turbulence. I wish more airlines had this feature.

Thanks so much for all the tracking, it is very cool to see after.

[Barb-SAN]

You're welcome,CAflyer, for the tracking. It really is some amazing, cutting edge technology that we are privileged to be able to use. I too have found it so helpful in understanding what's going on when the plane is banking, turning after take-off, weather, turbulence, etc. Tracking as an activity can be quite absorbing and calming in its own way too.

I haven't flown yet on any planes that have the seat back tracking, and am looking forward to that one day. What I do when I fly NWA is take out the route map that is in the Inflight magazine in the seat back pocket. I locate our route, and divide it into 1 hr. segments, and then start my stopwatch once we take off. That way I have at least a rough idea of where we are "in space". I try to get a window seat too. Some of the routes I've done enough that I recognize a lot of the landmarks. That familiarity is comforting. I've also looked at the landmarks on Google Earth, which makes them easier to find during a flight.

As far as that holding pattern that I posted on your thread on the tracking board, this one was almost at your destination. I found the information on the minute-by-minute track log.
The columns represent (starting at the left) Pacific Time, Location (Latitude), Location (Longitude), Ground Speed in Knots, Altitude in Feet, and the Air Traffic Control Facility.

If you look at the lat/long. at 13:03, you will see that they repeat at 13:14, which would indicate that the plane is passing the same point twice (i.e. flying in a circle).