Taking a seaplane on Tues the 4th - pretty nervous.

[CFH]

Hey guys, I just stumbled upon this site yesterday, it seems great. I just wanted to post on here and get a bit of advice. So, obviously, I'm pretty darn terrified of fling, which makes no sense considering I've been on at least 50 planes in my life. I was never scared of them until I had a bad experience at 16 (I don't even there was any real issue, just my mind running wild and convincing me that something was seriously wrong on a flight). I've flown a couple of times since then, but only out of pure necessity - it has been a frightening experience for me. I've also missed out on doing a lot of things because of this fear.
I also tragically lost my mother in an accident (not air plane related) about 6 months ago (I was 25 at the time), so I think that incident has made me quite scared of dying.
So what's the point of this long, rambling post you ask? I'm taking a seaplane down to Seattle (I live in Canada), and I am absolutely terrified. I'm taking the plane, instead of a bus, because I'm trying to face down my fears, which I feel is important, but I'm still frightened of the plane crashing or of drowning should it crash. Its only an hour long flight, so it shouldn't be too bad, but I just can't seem to get over the feeling that if I step foot in that plane I'm a goner. I've read a lot of the posts and information on the site, and it has truly been helpful, but I just can't shake this fear. One thing I've seen come up in other threads is the fear of ones own safety, but not worrying about someone else on a plane, which is true in my case - I don't really think flying is dangerous for others, but the thought of getting on a plane and taking off etc. scares me badly, as I'm convinced it will be the end of me.
I've been on a seaplane once before, and it was a wonderful experience.
I've also read in some posts where people feel as if they are getting omens telling them not to fly, I have that same problem - I've regularily had nightmares about dying in a plane crash for several years now (omens telling my not to fly?), so I that plays a big role in my fear. I think my fear comes down to a lack of control, as a friend of mine has his pilots liscence and I went flying with him once, and dispite terrible weather it was a great experience. I guess I'm just looking for some reassurance. Does anyone know if a seaplane is more or less dangerous than regular planes? Thanks for taking the time to read this long post. This is a wonderful site for persons like myself.

[Barb-SAN]

Hi CFH, Welcome aboard! First of all, I'm very sorry to hear that you have lost your mother recently, and at a relatively young age. :hug: I can certainly understand how that might make you afraid of dying in an accident. Have you considered working with a grief counselor, or participating in some sort of an in-person support group for people dealing with a death in the family?

As far as your specific question about seaplanes, I don't know the statistics about their safety. Perhaps you could find that information via a Google search. Intuitively, it would seem to me that it would depend on where you were flying...those pontoons could be mighty handy in an emergency landing if you were mostly flying over water! ;) A friend of mine who is a private pilot went up to Alaska to get her seaplane rating, and she had a great time...wonderful scenery! She enjoyed the experience.

About the nightmares...see the "Taking Off" thread...I posted a link to an article about them there.

I think the fact that you have had some positive experiences with flying in the past can certainly be helpful in overcoming your current fears. I applaud you for taking the flight specifically to challenge yourself to get over the fear! :cool:

Have you tried tracking your flight? What's the airline? Will you be planning to talk to the pilot before your flight? That can help a great deal. Be sure to print out our meet-the-pilot letter to take with you.

[CFH]

Hi Barb-SAN, thanks for the response and the kind words. I'll check out that article you suggested. I don't think its possible to track the flight as it is just with a local seaplane company that operates in a small area - but I could be wrong. I'm also not sure if meeting the pilot is possible, but that could help. I'm just going to try and tough it out, like I said before its not a long flight (only about an hour), so I think I'll be able to handle it. Thanks again.

[Barb-SAN]

Hi Barb-SAN, thanks for the response and the kind words. I'll check out that article you suggested. I don't think its possible to track the flight as it is just with a local seaplane company that operates in a small area - but I could be wrong. I'm also not sure if meeting the pilot is possible, but that could help. I'm just going to try and tough it out, like I said before its not a long flight (only about an hour), so I think I'll be able to handle it. Thanks again.

You might check on www.flightaware.com (http://www.flightaware.com) and see. It's possible that you will only see results of the U.S. portion of the flight. You can track planes by tail number there (if they file a flight plan). Perhaps the local seaplane company will tell you the tail number if you tell them why you want to know. Or...just go over to the airport and look at the plane! It can be reassuring to see that the plane has made that same flight successfully over and over.

Also, if the plane is very small, you might be able to see the pilots from your seat. If you meet them beforehand, it could be both interesting and reassuring to watch them fly the plane. If there isn't assigned seating, try to get a seat up front. :thumbsup:

One of our members (gordies) had that experience on one of his flights. The link to his story is here: http://www.takingflight.us/forums/showthread.php?t=5001

[CFH]

Thanks for the links. The flight is two days away now, and I'm starting to freak out a bit. Some people have told me that seaplanes are more dangerous than regular planes, which hasn't helped much. I find myself concerned about seemingly stupid things like bird strikes etc. I think I'm really going to have to force myself to get on the plane.
Hopefully I'll come back on the forum afterwards and let you know how it went.

[Barb-SAN]

Have you had a chance to check out www.anxieties.com (http://www.anxieties.com)? It's a site we recommend frequently here. There's a very good section there on fear of flying, and it is free. Yes, of course you can "force yourself" to get on the plane...but it might be more enjoyable if you try some of those anxiety-reducing strategies. See what works for you. ;)

Would it be convenient for you to go over to the airport tomorrow and have a little chat with the folks who run the seaplane company, and discuss your concerns with them directly? I'm assuming that since it's a small, local operation, it might be easier to have a casual chat, perhaps even with one of the pilots.

[CFH]

I don't know if talking to the people who work for the airline would help, but I'm afraid I don't have time as I have college that day - I'd skip class and go, but I'm already missing the last day of the semester in order to take this trip. I mentioned my apprehension to the girl who was working at the office when I went in to pay for my ticket, but she just looked at me and asked why I was flying if I was scared (a fair question - something I've been asking myself). I've been looking at anxieties.com and it seems like a good site. I don't think anything is going to make me feel better about flying in the seaplane (aside from getting on it and making it to our destination), but hopefully I can manage to keep myself as calm as possible. All the bad weather around here isn't making it any easier though. Thanks again for replying to my messages.

[Barb-SAN]

All the bad weather around here isn't making it any easier though. Thanks again for replying to my messages.

You're welcome. Yes, I was wondering about that weather in the Pacific NW myself...:eek:. I saw that there were wind gusts over 100 MPH along the Oregon coast. Hopefully the weather will improve by Tuesday. I'd assume that if it is too windy, the flights will be cancelled. They do have certain flight restrictions, depending on the direction and speed of the wind, relative to the runway. Hmmm...just remembered, it's a SEAPLANE....so guess there is no runway! But...there must be some circumstances, like height of waves, etc. that could affect their take-off and landings. Now I'm curious...having not had that flying experience myself.

As far as why you are flying when you are scared, isn't it to tackle your fear, and try to overcome it?

I hope that you will take lots of notes, and pictures, to share with us here afterwards!

[Barb-SAN]

Just did a Google search for "seaplanes"...here are a couple links, for background information: :D

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seaplane

http://www.kenmoreair.com/

http://www.nwseaplanes.com/

This link contains a pilot briefing for passengers on a seaplane. It will be interesting to see if you get information something like this for your flight.
http://www.secureav.com/seaplane-briefing.doc

[CFH]

I actually found all of those sites before I found this one. The seaplane-briefing one actually scared me pretty good. Kenmore Air happens to be the company which runs the seaplane we will be flying on. The closer it gets and the more I obsess about it, the less sure I am that I can actually do it.

[tusphotog]

The meat of the storm (the "good stuff") up there should blow through by Monday evening. Seaplanes are limited in their operation by wave height, so if the winds are really blowing like they were Sunday, then they won't fly. Depending on the type of plane you find yourself on, you might (if you ask nicely) be able to sit up front.

When you get to Seattle, make sure you head straight to Ivar's Salmon House (or Ivar's House of Clams). Both are right on the water. http://www.ivars.net/Salmon_House_Home/salmon.html

It's FANTASTIC!

[Barb-SAN]

Kenmore Air happens to be the company which runs the seaplane we will be flying on.

Here's some information from the Kenmore Air's site...which I must say does make me want to take that flight for the photo opportunities!! I sure hope that you will take your camera, and get a window seat! ;)

Seaplaneshttp://www.kenmoreair.com/images/content_head_right.gif The Experience
The Kenmore seaplane experience is unique to any other, where spectacular views substitute in-flight movies and uncanny airplane meals are bypassed completely. Flights are fun, fast, and every route offers a different adventure. Watch from 1,000 feet up as the lively downtown Seattle leads to vast inland waterways of Puget Sound, snow-capped peaks of the Cascades and unsurpassed vistas from the San Juans to Victoria B.C.
http://www.kenmoreair.com/images/slideshow/slide13.jpg
The Planes
When the deHavilland Beaver production line shut down in 1967, Kenmore took over rebuilding the planes and has since been turning them out better than ever, setting a new standard by which all Beavers are judged. Our team rebuilds, repairs, installs and customizes the Beavers to meet the requests and satisfaction of our customers. We incorporate either standard Kenmore or custom mods and install avionics, upholstery, zero-time engines, new floats and landing gear as needed. We’ve successfully rebuilt over 135 Beavers, including several for international customers as well as those in our own fleet.
Kenmore Air operates both floatplanes and wheel planes. The seven-passenger Piston Beaver is the most successful floatplane ever built and has been the mainstay of our fleet since the early 60's. It sports a thick wing for maximum lift, a sturdy structure and a powerful 450 horsepower Pratt Whitney R-985 radial engine. The Turbine Beaver has increased carrying capacity, a higher climb rate and faster cruise speed, and the single-engine Turbine Otter is the largest and most powerful in the seaplane fleet.
The wheel planes include the eight-passenger Cessna Grand Caravan. The Caravan is the fastest in our fleet and can accommodate 8-9 passengers.
As far as safety goes, our flight team has an outstanding track record, with meticulous inspection by the FAA supplementary to our own uncompromising safety standards." (emphasis, Barb-SAN)
http://www.kenmoreair.com/images/slideshow/slide4.jpg

[Barb-SAN]

The seaplane-briefing one actually scared me pretty good.

Um, I found that briefing to be a bit sobering as well. But...better to think about it ahead of time, so that you know what to do. Emergency briefings are routine on large commercial jets too. Though you almost NEVER need to use that information, having it tucked away in your mind might make the difference between life and death one day.

Just like when you are driving your car...do you know what to do if your engine suddenly caught on fire, or your right front tire blew out when you're driving 70 MPH during rush hour on the freeway? It's easier to not think about those things, and assume that they will never happen. But, if you learn how to handle those emergencies ahead of time, you're helping to stack the odds in your favor. :cool:

[CFH]

Um, I found that briefing to be a bit sobering as well. But...better to think about it ahead of time, so that you know what to do. Emergency briefings are routine on large commercial jets too. Though you almost NEVER need to use that information, having it tucked away in your mind might make the difference between life and death one day.

Just like when you are driving your car...do you know what to do if your engine suddenly caught on fire, or your right front tire blew out when you're driving 70 MPH during rush hour on the freeway? It's easier to not think about those things, and assume that they will never happen. But, if you learn how to handle those emergencies ahead of time, you're helping to stack the odds in your favor. :cool:

Thats pretty much what I figured and why I read it, though some of the stuff in there is quite terrifying.
Its less than 24 hours from flight time, in fact by this time tommorow I should hopefully just be passing through customs, and I'll probably still be shaking :D. Thanks for all of the responses to my thread and please send all the positive thoughts you can my way. Thanks again, and provided I make it I will post about my experience on here sometime before the end of the weekend (hopefully, I'm pretty busy with exams). Thanks again. Josh C.

[Barb-SAN]

O.K....we'll be sending positive thoughts your way! Remember to BREATHE....and keep your muscles relaxed! :D

I was just looking at the hour-by-hour forecast for the Seattle weather. As Tusphotog mentioned...it is supposed to be better weather tomorrow...still some rain, but less windy.

You mentioned earlier that you did enjoy a flight in "terrible weather" in a small plane in the past...so that's a good sign that you may in fact do just fine tomorrow. :thumbsup:

Now...do you have that "meet the pilot" letter printed out? I assure you (having done it MANY times), that talking to the pilot is one of the "secret tips" to having a more enjoyable flight. Don't be afraid to mention that you are nervous (it DID say that the pilot should know about that in the seaplane preflight briefing...;)). The pilot should know just what to say to put your mind at ease...usually something like how experienced he is, how many times he's flown that route without any problems, etc. And he might give you a little cockpit tour.

If you are REALLY lucky, and there is no copilot (which there probably is not, for a plane that small), you might get to sit in the copilot's seat. I think that's what Tusphotog was referring to by sitting "up front". It wouldn't hurt to get there early, and ASK! That would be the very best view, plus you could see just what he's doing, which might make you feel a lot more relaxed, and give you something "technical" to focus on.

We'll be looking forward to your trip report...(at least let us know you made it O.K....then more details when you have time).

I THINK you are the first person to write about flying on a seaplane here on Taking Flight.

[Barb-SAN]

By the way, Kenmore Air is listed on FlightAware, though I didn't know what flight numbers to try to track. If you know what yours is, you might see if you can see the tracks of any previous flights.

I did look on FlightAware to see what the Seattle airport activity is right now. The aviation weather report (at : http://adds.aviationweather.noaa.gov/tafs/index.php ) indicates winds gusting to 30 MPH from the South. You can see numerous storm cells off to the west of Seattle, but none right over the airport. The planes are landing into the wind (to the south). Here's the link: and a screen shot: http://flightaware.com/live/airport_status_bigmap.rvt?airport=KSEA&key=af9ee42365dd0d899fa706396144bbf63c7ebd74

It can be interesting to watch the airport activity, and reassuring to see that the planes avoid the areas of red on the radar (the most intense storm activity). All day long, they land and take off, generally without incident. I enjoy watching the airport activity. It looks like a choreographed ballet. Those planes are under the watchful eye of air traffic control, and are directed just where they need to go.

One more link you might find interesting is here: http://www.liveatc.net/feedindex.php . Scroll down the page to KSEA...and you can hear the communications between the pilots and the tower.

[CFH]

Thanks for posting the weather reports Barb, I sure hope the winds clear up before my flight, but I'm trying to put that out of my mind. Our flight number is 351, I do not have a laptop and so I won't be able to track it, but if you feel like doing so feel free. In a strange way it would be comforting to know that someone was watching. Thanks again for all of your help and support, if you don't hear from me before I leave, I'll surely write up a report of the flight for you guys or at the very least let you know we made it safely. Luckily we're taking the Clipper (a boat) back, so I only have to worry about 1 flight and not two. Josh.

[CFH]

I forgot to mention this, but as we are going to be in a seaplane we will not be landing at the airport, but rather on Lake Union (I think thats its name), does the flightaware site chronicle those flights as well?

[Barb-SAN]

Well, I checked on FlightAware with that flight number, and came up with this, from Sept.2006... :( : http://flightaware.com/live/flight/KEN351 It's not a seaplane, and it didn't originate in Canada.
So, maybe they aren't set up to be currently tracked on FlightAware. I'll check tomorrow just in case. But, if that's their regular flight number, it should show a whole history there of recent flights.

[tusphotog]

I forgot to mention this, but as we are going to be in a seaplane we will not be landing at the airport, but rather on Lake Union (I think thats its name), does the flightaware site chronicle those flights as well?

Tell the pilot you'll give him $50 (Canadian) if he'll float you right up to Ivar's. :D

Seriously, have a good trip. You'll be just fine. Flight aware only tracks flights to airports, and since Lake Union is a big hole in the ground full of water, I doubt that you can search for the lake. I could be wrong though.

[Barb-SAN]

Flight aware only tracks flights to airports, and since Lake Union is a big hole in the ground full of water, I doubt that you can search for the lake. I could be wrong though.

Ahhhhh, so that's the problem. Thanks for the answer!:tiphat:

[CFH]

Tell the pilot you'll give him $50 (Canadian) if he'll float you right up to Ivar's. :D

Seriously, have a good trip. You'll be just fine. Flight aware only tracks flights to airports, and since Lake Union is a big hole in the ground full of water, I doubt that you can search for the lake. I could be wrong though.
I'll try to check out that restaurant, thanks for responding. I bought myself a mp3 player today as a reward for getting on the flight, so I can't back out now. I am getting more nervous the closer I get to it though.

[Barb-SAN]

I bought myself a mp3 player today as a reward for getting on the flight, so I can't back out now. I am getting more nervous the closer I get to it though.

Uh huh, rewarding yourself ahead of time, eh? You're right...can't back out now, or you will have to return that mp3 player to the store...;)

Nervous = excited? They feel similar to me...both fueled by adrenaline. "Excited" is more "fun", though!

Hope you have some great dreams tonight...maybe soaring through the skies like an eagle?? :D ....and landing in the lake like a Canadian Goose....

[Rebecca]

Wow, we've got a state of emergency declared on the west side of Washington State at the moment, what with rain, flooding and winds over there. Looks like I-5 is closed due to rising Chehalis River. Will be good to hear if Josh had his seaplane adventure or not!
:sunshine:

[Barb-SAN]

Here's the radar, and airport activity around KSEA, taken at 3:20PM PST, which should be around the time that you are getting into the Seattle area, assuming you did take that flight. It looks like all the storm activity has moved away to the east, so hopefully you had a smooth flight and landing. We can see several planes landing and taking off at KSEA...so that's a good sign!

[Barb-SAN]

Here's the latest aviation weather (at 2:53 PST)...looking good...though a bit breezy..maybe a bit bumpy?;)

[CFH]

Hey guys, just thought I'd write to let you know how my flight went. I made it on to the plane, which I wasn't positive I was going to do until the last moment. It went ok I guess, it was a pretty frightening experience for me, I guess it'll take more than one flight to cure this phobia. I was sitting in the row behind the pilot, so I saw almost everything he did. The ride was fine until we got about 10 mins outside of Seattle, then it got pretty rough - not that it was anything serious but it sure scared me. I actually don't know if my fear has been eased at all, but I did survive, though I looked like quite the coward in the process. There was an older gentleman on the flight who was seated behind me and whenever it got really rough I'd look back at him for re-assurance and he'd give me the thumbs-up gesture, which helped me greatly.
I guess that's about it really, I made it safe and sound so that's the important thing.
Thanks again for all the words of support and encouragement, I don't know if I would've been able to do this without them.

[Barb-SAN]

:hyped::hyped: Woohoo!!! Good for you, Josh, for getting on the plane, and taking that trip in spite of your fears, and that storm that blew through the day before.

It sounds like you might have gotten some of those bumps from the 25 mph wind gusts as you were coming in to land in Seattle.

Could you tell us a little more about the actual flight? Most of us have never flown in a seaplane before. Were there waves when you were taking off and landing? What was it like taxiing? Did you talk to the pilot at all? That's great that you were able to sit behind him, and watch what he was doing.

I was asking a friend of mine who is a pilot who lives up that way about Kenmore Air, and he said that they have a good reputation for safety, and that there's nothing safer than a seaplane flying over water. He also said that the usual technique for takeoff is to get above the waves as quickly as possible, then accelerate and fly level while increasing speed, then climb.

Personally, I found that it took more than one flight (in the big jets) to get really comfortable flying commercially. This past year I've tried to fly every couple months, and that has helped a lot to make it routine. Flying in small planes (and handling the controls) is what helped me understand turbulence. But...I still get a good jolt of adrenaline when it gets bumpy. Then...I try to remember to keep my body relaxed, and keep breathing, slow and regular.

O.K....so hope you will tell us some more details about your flight!

Hope you are enjoying that well-deserved MP3 player too!!

[CFH]

:hyped::hyped: Woohoo!!! Good for you, Josh, for getting on the plane, and taking that trip in spite of your fears, and that storm that blew through the day before.

It sounds like you might have gotten some of those bumps from the 25 mph wind gusts as you were coming in to land in Seattle.

Could you tell us a little more about the actual flight? Most of us have never flown in a seaplane before. Were there waves when you were taking off and landing? What was it like taxiing? Did you talk to the pilot at all? That's great that you were able to sit behind him, and watch what he was doing.

I was asking a friend of mine who is a pilot who lives up that way about Kenmore Air, and he said that they have a good reputation for safety, and that there's nothing safer than a seaplane flying over water. He also said that the usual technique for takeoff is to get above the waves as quickly as possible, then accelerate and fly level while increasing speed, then climb.

Personally, I found that it took more than one flight (in the big jets) to get really comfortable flying commercially. This past year I've tried to fly every couple months, and that has helped a lot to make it routine. Flying in small planes (and handling the controls) is what helped me understand turbulence. But...I still get a good jolt of adrenaline when it gets bumpy. Then...I try to remember to keep my body relaxed, and keep breathing, slow and regular.

O.K....so hope you will tell us some more details about your flight!

Hope you are enjoying that well-deserved MP3 player too!!

I'll try my best to describe what the flight was like... The planes itself was quite small (I think it was a Beaver), seating about 7 people. The water was pretty calm and glassy when we went to take off (I was kind of hoping it would be too choppy for the plane to take off, thus facilitating the airline putting us on the Clipper - a boat). As soon as the pilot opened up the throttle and started to accelerate the planes nose felt like it was straining upwards, almost like it wanted to fly. I wondered if we were still touching the water, but I assume we were. The take-off felt like it occurred over a very small area as compared to taking off from a runway which seems to take longer, but I could be completely wrong about that, its just how it felt. From watching the planes take off earlier in the day, it seemed as if they climbed fairly sharply, but it didn't really feel that way from inside the aircraft (though I was so scared my perceptions could be completely wrong). We seemed to climb quite gradually, and if I read the instrument pannel correctly we were flying between 1,800 - 2,100 ft. for most of the trip. The view was beautiful, but I was really in no condition to fully appreciate it. Before we boarded, the pilot warned us that it would be rough on the approach to Seattle, but the first time the plane dropped a bit from turbulence I felt my heart sink with it. I've been in worse turbulence, but for some reason I don't mind it as much on bigger planes. The landing was ok for the most part, when the pontoons first touched the waves it felt quite bumpy, like when you're in a car and you're driving over the reflecters which divide the lanes.
If you have any questions about the flight that I did not answer in this post, feel free to post them and I will do my best to satisfy your curiousity.

[Barb-SAN]

, and if I read the instrument pannel correctly we were flying between 1,800 - 2,100 ft. for most of the trip. The view was beautiful, but I was really in no condition to fully appreciate it.

According to the aviation weather report, the ceiling was at 3,200 ft. (where the clouds start), and there were a few clouds at 2,500 ft.. So it's likely that you were reading the instrument panel correctly, as you said you had a beautiful view.

Yes, it was the take-off and landing that I was most curious about...what it felt like to touch down in waves, and how the pilot controlled the plane. The fact that you thought the take-off seemed to take place over a very small area confirms what my pilot friend said too...getting airborne quickly and above the waves. That would make sense, when you think about what it's like to ride in a motorboat over waves...it gets pretty rough the faster you go over them.

Thanks!

Would you consider taking another flight with them? Maybe this time just a scenic tour, and pick a day and time that the air is calm, the sun is shining...and just go to appreciate the view! It can be much more relaxing when it isn't turbulent.

[Barb-SAN]

Well, this is a bit after the fact, but I just did a Google search for images of your seaplane, and found some of the cockpit, and also some scenic ones. One of them makes me think of a plane water-skiing ;)... Note also that there's a link to the engine sounds for this plane....in case you want to listen and let yourself relax to those sounds. :)

http://www.mistyfjordsair.com/beaver.html

And, look, you can get it on a mousepad!! http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.wingsamerica.com/webart/products/small/492.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.wingsamerica.com/index.cfm%3FFuseaction%3DResults%26CatID%3D34&h=290&w=375&sz=43&hl=en&start=38&tbnid=h6xlLhoAf-KGYM:&tbnh=94&tbnw=122&prev=