Turbulence

[Lynda]

Hi Captain Hutch

I have mostly got over my Fear of flying after working on it the last few years. My fear now is down to Turbulence!!! I hate the stuff, I don't even like the stuff you call mild chop!

What is the worst turbulence you have flown through as a commercial pilot????

How do you catagorise levels of turbulence and what would this feel like to me the passenger?

Thank you

[Agne]

Good question Lynda!!!!

Turbulence is what scares me most on a flight. Actually, I can say it's the only thing I am afraid of. If the flight is completely smooth, I am totally calm.

[Captain Hutch]

Lynda,

That IS a good question.

There are three main levels of turbulence: light, moderate, and severe. To the passenger, the meanings of these levels can be interpreted thusly:

Light: occupants may feel a slight strain against seat belts, liquids shaking but not splashing out of cup, little or no difficulty encountered in walking.

Moderate: occupants feel definite strains against seat belts, liquids splashing out of cups, difficulty in walking.

Severe: occupants forced violently against seat belt, items falling or lifting off surface, walking is impossible.

If there is sort of a washboard effect to light or moderate turbulence, sort of like a speedboat moving across the water with ripples or small waves, then the pilots will use the word “chop” instead of “turbulence”. Most of you flyers out there have experienced light or moderate turbulence, but actual severe turbulence is encountered infrequently. Commonly pilots will further clarify light turbulence as “very light”, “light ripple”, or something to that effect. Another relatively common condition could be “light with occasional moderate”.

We do get predictions for the level of turbulence along the route of flight, but these are usually educated guesses, and the best information comes from other aircraft in the vicinity of your flight. Rest assured that the pilots and controllers are doing their best to find a smooth altitude for your flight, the controllers because they don’t want to listen to the complaints of the pilots and the pilots because they want a smooth ride just like you do.
Personally I have experienced severe turbulence only maybe once or twice in my career, and then only for a short period. Nobody really likes getting jolted continuously for an extended period of time, but basically we know that the aircraft are built incredibly well and have full confidence in the flying capability under even the most extreme conditions.

I do have one aside in a related item. Do you know when the flight attendant makes the initial announcement and says, "Be careful when you open the overhead bins after the flight has arrived at your destination because items may have shifted."? I would really take heed since I have myself witnessed folks nearly getting injured when one passenger opens a bin and a bag will drop out accidentally on an unsuspecting passenger still seated, usually in an aisle seat.

Now I have an open question, and I can certainly guess the answer, and possibly has been addressed already but maybe new people have new ideas, exactly what is the fear about turbulence?

Hope this helps. :)

Hutch

[Lynda]

Thanks for the imformative reply.
What am I scared of well perhaps a few things really.

1. It makes me feel a bit motion sick although not as much as it used to do.
2. I can't see the bumps.

3.As an occasional IBS sufferer ( when anxious) I have a great fear of not being able to get up and use a bathroom if needed. This is irrational as I always take immodium prior to flying! Again it is a what if type question.

4.I know the airplane is safe and I actually now trust the pilots but something inside me just gives me that stomach churning adreniline inducing fear.

I am sure there are others with different fears who will post.
:)

[Barb-SAN]

I find the falling or shaking sensation (and the creaking noise that the plane and overhead bins make) triggers an immediate adrenaline rush.

As I mentioned in my moderator bio, I was living in Guatemala during a strong earthquake (1976) that had many aftershocks. I saw much destruction, and read daily in the papers details of deaths, and many photos of devastation. Aftershocks continued for many months, and I was so sensitized to that shaking motion that it would awaken me from a sound sleep, heart racing and ready to run. So...somehow that response got connected to the shaking sensation when flying in turbulence, :eek: and triggers the same adrenaline response (and there's nowhere to run!!).

What I've done to cope with it, and try to desensitize myself to that feeling, has been to take Cessna flying lessons. I'm trying to become more accustomed to that sensation, and understand that the plane doesn't drop all that much, that it keeps right on flying, etc. That has been very helpful, and there is a carry-over effect for flying commercially (I remember the Cessna lessons when we hit turbulence....;) ).

I've also recently driven some gravel roads in Michigan...full of potholes...and thought about how much more "turbulent" that is than flying, and how well the car handles it anyway.

The other thing I do when we hit turbulence when flying is to do a "body check"...be sure I'm breathing properly, and do some progressive relaxation exercises (tensing and then relaxing the muscles in my legs, arms, hands, and face....then sitting quietly without fidgiting ). Then I take a peek at my thoughts, and remind myself that everything will be fine, the plane can handle turbulence, the pilots are experienced, etc. That seems to keep the anxiety from spiraling into full-blown panic (so far, anyway...)

I've come to the conclusion that for me, even if I always get a little jolt of adrenaline when turbulence hits, I have some tools for coping with it. Since I started flying again, the most turbulence I've experienced has been "light to moderate" over the front range of the Rockies near Denver. (I asked the pilots on the way off the plane in SAN to rate it for me...ha ha...;) , and that's what they said. I was thinking they would say moderate to severe....).

Like Lynda, I also have some fears of getting motion sick. So far I've only experienced that on boats, not planes....but it's no fun. I try to sit forward of the wing whenever possible. I have had some queasiness in the Cessna when photographing, especially if I use the zoom lens. I've also noticed those stomach lurches in uncoordinated turns (in the Cessna). I eat candied ginger before flying...think that helps somewhat. I've gotten quite sick from Dramamine, so am afraid to take that now, and can't when taking flying lessons anyway.

I always appreciate the pilots who give some warning about when they will be turning on the seat belts signs for turbulence (if they know ahead of time)...so I can do the bathroom run while the flight is smooth. I do wonder what might happen if I was in the bathroom when the flight got too turbulent to return to my seat. I don't recall seeing a seat belt in there....:tongue:

You make a good point, Capt. Hutch, about paying attention to falling suitcases from the overhead bins. I'd guess that might be more dangerous to passengers than turbulence. That's another reason I prefer a window seat. Then I don't need to worry about some passenger ignoring the "fasten seat belt" sign, walking the aisles, and falling on me! (Have you seen any injuries from THAT??)

I'm relieved to hear that you have only experienced severe turbulence once or twice in your career, and that it didn't last long. Do you recall where that was? (Stories....we love them....:D )

Thanks...

[spiffyone]

I have to say that I am not particularly afraid of turbulence - but I think what some people fear is that the plane will drop out of the sky, and the turbulence is that phenomenon beginning to happen.

I actually love boats and am used to the rolling/bouncing on boats, so I think of the air as being like water (which at that speed, I think it acts like water) and being something you can't "fall through."

I do like knowing ahead of time that it will be bumpy - that helps a lot. It only bothers me when it's so bumpy that I can't write or read - because I enjoy spending my flight time on those things.

Also I agree with Lynda, being barred for an indeterminate period of times from the bathrooms kind of stresses me out.

[Agne]

I am afraid that the pilot will lose control of the plane. Is that possible? I've read that in severe/extreme turbulence the plane can be out of control. Does it happen also in moderate turbulence, maybe for short periods?

OK.. this one may sound stupid: does turbulence affect the speed of the plane? And, if it does, does it affect it much? In other words, can the plane stall?

[Captain Hutch]

Agne,

You have some good questions. Yes, in severe and extreme turbulence the aircraft actually is momentarily out of control and there are variations in airspeed, the amount of course depends on how severe the turbulence is. By the definition of “moderate”, this momentary out-of-control condition does not occur. Airliners are built to be extremely stable craft and always “want” to fly. The aircraft already has its flying speed since that is what it was doing before it arrived at the area of turbulence—it will not just lose its energy just because it ran into some unstable air! So the aircraft keeps its energy to fly with and as soon as the aircraft is back in less than severe turbulence it will be fully controllable. In different words, just because an aircraft flight surface will not momentarily respond the way it is designed does not mean the aircraft will stall and fall out of the sky.

Remember somewhere in one of these threads I mentioned that I had only been in severe turbulence maybe once or twice in my career, and only for a short period of time. I am not sure if there is a way to listen to the Center frequencies, but if you did, and the air was fairly calm, you wouldn’t hear too much exchange between the pilots and controllers. But if there was any turbulence out there at all, the controllers and pilots would constantly be talking about where the turbulence was and how bad, and what altitudes are better than others, and pilots would be requesting to change to those altitudes at their first opportunity. And believe me, if there were any severe turbulence reports out there, the pilots would get another route so as to fly around it and the controllers would be letting every single aircraft know where that severe turbulence was located. The glitch, as always, has been how exactly to tell where that turbulence is before someone gets there, but since this is not always possible, it is best to keep you seatbelt on while in your seat. And for the most part, if the seat belt sign is “on”, it is best to stay in your seat, but if you really need to get up to use the restroom and it is not too bumpy, just mention to the flight attendant that you “really” need to use the facilities, or even kind of point to the restroom if the flight attendant sees you but can’t hear you and walk to the restroom in the rear of the aircraft (so your movement won’t be interpreted as a possible security issue). I may get some flak for this from some flight attendants but I think most will agree that this is better than the alternative.

I hope this makes some of the turbulence issues a little smoother.
:tiphat:
Hutch

[Agne]

Thanks for your reply Capt. Hutch! :thumbsup:

[Barb-SAN]

And for the most part, if the seat belt sign is “on”, it is best to stay in your seat, but if you really need to get up to use the restroom and it is not too bumpy, just mention to the flight attendant that you “really” need to use the facilities, or even kind of point to the restroom if the flight attendant sees you but can’t hear you and walk to the restroom in the rear of the aircraft (so your movement won’t be interpreted as a possible security issue). I may get some flak for this from some flight attendants but I think most will agree that this is better than the alternative.

I hope this makes some of the turbulence issues a little smoother.
:tiphat:
Hutch

Thanks for your turbulence explanations, Capt. Hutch.

Recently I was on a flight from San Diego to Detroit, and the fasten seat belt sign was on for almost the entire 4+ hr. trip. That's just too long for me to sit still without a break, and a trip to the restroom. It wasn't very bumpy most of the time. What happened is that quite a few people did ignore the fasten seat belt sign, and get up and go to the back restroom. Just my luck, after waiting in line about 10 minutes, it got bumpy and I had to go back to my seat, and try again later. The FA's didn't seem concerned that we were in line, until it got bumpy...then they they sent us back to our seats. That's the only time I've disobeyed the seat belt sign...but like you said...what is the alternative? Plus...there are other risks of staying seated for too many hours at a time (DVT). Most long flights I've been on have not had the sign on for the entire flight.

[WillFlyToDisney]

Thanks, Captain Hutch for the info on turbulence.

I consider myself a pretty seasoned flyer at this point but turbulence (especially at night or during cloudy weather when I can't see the ground) still seems to make me nervous. I know turbulence can't hurt the plane and I know we are safe BUT the bumps just make me feel like we are unsafe. I think it is probably because we can't SEE the bumpy air and it seems like we are out of control that makes it so scary.

What I have found that works best for me is to crank my Ipod to up-tempo songs and take a deep breath and force myself to sink into my seat. I flew a few days ago with my infant son and didn't have my Ipod with me and I sure missed it when we hit some rough patches in the air!

[Captain Hutch]

Hey I like the crank up the ipod idea! :D

Hutch