Long Flights

[mana]

Hi,

I've been dealing with this fear for about 7 years now and it's definitely been very hard and emotional. Last year I did a few flights then had a panic attack on a 4 hour flight and couldn't fly again. This year I started again. I've been doing great on the short flights with some anxiety. My problem is dealing with a longer flight. I'm again trying a 4 hour flight this Saturday and starting to get terrified and feeling sick. I can't get past the lenght of time I would have to spend on board. I do take some medication, it calms the anxiety but I still don't feel the hope or courage to go through with it. The panick attacks I've had on planes are miserable and I hate being that terrified. It's the only place I've ever had panick attacks.

Any advice on how to deal with longer flights. The crew doesn't always let me meet the Captain and that makes me feel worse.

Thanks so much.

[mana]

Thank you so much for your reply. That's what overwhelms me when I think about the length of the flight and it becomes too much. It's a good idea to try and break it down that way but I'm still trying to get past the fear of the length of the trip. I always travelled so much before this fear set in and loved it.

You're right about the anxiety, it starts in the beginning and once you settle down seems to pass. I'll print out the letter on the site.

Thanks so much for your advice.

[WillFlyToDisney]

Long trips can get to you because of the sheer amount of time you are cooped up with nothing to do - your mind starts to wander and you seem to feel every little bump or ripple. Talk to your doctor about the amount of medication you are taking - perhaps you need to have your dosage adjusted.

Meet the Captain - get there early and let the gate agents know that you are a very fearful flyer and that you would feel more at ease if you could have a quick word with the pilot. If the people you talk to don't listen, find someone else that will!

Take lots to do to keep your mind busy - Gameboy, DVD player, Ipod, magazines, puzzle books. I have certain DVDs that I only watch on flights - my favorites are my "Will and Grace" DVDs.

Good luck! Feel free to post away with any questions or concerns. I would also recommend getting Captain Rays book and taking Captain Stacey's free online course (both have links at the bottom of this page).

:welcome:

Kelley

[Agne]

Hi Mana, I am on your same boat. I have a 11 hours flight in august.
Breaking the flight into segments, keeping your mind busy, and thinking about your destination: very good ideas!!
Moreover, one thing helped in my last flight (9 hours and 40 min): writing. Write down what happens, and what has happened since the moment you woke up in the morning.. had breakfast, drove to the airport, boarded. Describe the people who sit next to you. Write down what you had for lunch, what movie you watched. Everything ! Time will FLY.
The first hour and the last hour go by very fast: so 4-2= you have only 2 hours !!

[PositiveE]

Hi Mana -

I also do much better on shorter flights generally speaking....

My boyfriend and I are supposed to go to Hawaii next Spring and honestly I don't know if I can do it. It would be the longest flight(s) I have ever done. Have been to Europe 3 times, but boy Hawaii feels so far away from New England and it is!

I'm glad that the flight will be broken up into two segments, but flying from the West Coast to Hawaii really freaks me out. Don't like to be over water that long.

I suffer from panic disorder although it has gotten significantly better over the 25 years that I've been dealing with it. My only problem now is flying.

Just out of curiosity, what parts of flying to you have the most problems with? I don't have any issues to speak of with turbulence or fear of crashing or weather, etc. Mine is the claustrophobia and knowing that I am STUCK on that plane.

[chdsgrl]

Well, Mana, I am the queen of panic attacks and not just on planes, either.

I had a massive panic attack once in a movie theater. It was so bad that I had to leave my date and stand on the side of the theater to watch the movie because if I had to get out, I had to get out. At the time, I felt perfectly justified because I was so fearful, but as I look back I realize that nothing would have happened to me if I had stayed in my seat, because nothing happened to me while I was standing on the side. It was just more comfortable for me there.

After that panic attack, I didn't go to the movies for a year and a half, becuase I was afraid I would have another one. And so, I missed out on some really great movies. I tried to tell myself that it was just as good to rent the DVD when it came out, but it really wasn't. I missed the whole movie experience, and the popcorn, and the screaming kids. :tongue: Anyway, the first time I went to a movie after that, I went with my Mom, because I feel very comfortable with her. I had learned some breathing techniques, and self-talk, and I understood that the panic attack wouldn't hurt me. And, I made it through the whole movie without incident. I had prepared myself and it paid off.

Are you familiar with what causes panic attacks, and when they happen, how they get out of control to make you feel terrified? If not, I could give you some insight into that, too...which I found helped me tremendously.

Let me know!

[jazzy]

I would also like to hear how you handle these attacks as i have had them myself over the years, i have to sit on the end at the movie theatre, i feel trapped sitting in the middle of a bunch of people. Nice to hear other people have these fears as well.

[chdsgrl]

Of course I would love to share!! :pompoms:

A little history first:

When I was about 17, I started feeling like I couldn't swallow sometimes, mostly when I was driving, or sitting in traffic. Then I started feeling like my chest would get tight, and it was really hard to take a breath. I went to a doctor, who told me that it was anxiety, and just to kinda deal with it, and it would be fine. (he's not my doctor anymore).

It started to get worse and worse, with different symtoms. Not being able to take a deep breath, upset stomach, not being able to swallow, headaches (I was sure I had a brain tumor for the longest time). And when I would go places where I felt like I was trapped (movies, nail parlor) I would get these panic attacks and it was terrifying. I would end up going to the ER each time, and they would send me home with some ativan.

It wasn't untill I fully understood what panic was, and how to deal with it that it started getting better and better. I had a very difficult pregnancy with my son, and my panic attacks would happen about every 15 minutes for 6 months. I was bedridden, my OB had me see a cardiologist, and they determined that my resting heart rate was on average 156 beats a minute. So, that, combined with the stressful pregnancy led me into panic attack hell.

I started doing as much research as possible on the subject. I read books, I searched on the net, and I talked to everyone I could about it. It was horrible not being able to do ANYTHING because I was afraid if I moved, I would dislodge my phatom tumor and I would surely die. I know that sounds silly, but at the time, it was very, very real.

I also had an aversion to medication. I had a horrible reaction to pennecilian once, and vowed never to take anything ever again. But, at the doctor's urging I tried wellbutrin, paxil among others. As it turns out, some of those medications actually have an anxiety producing agent in them. Yeah, that's a GREAT thing to give an already anxious person. So, I decided not to take it.

What I found out in my research was that panic itself is the fear of panic. We have a panic attack and then sit around fearing the next one (which is no way to live, I might add). What happens when we have a panic attack is called the fear adrenylin fear cycle. For whatever reason, we start to panic, and when that happens, our body automatically releases adrenylin. It does this because it's a very NATURAL thing for it to do. All mammals have the flight or fight instinct, so when we start to panic, our body releases the adrenylin to kinda wake us up to whatever is going on. Well, when that happens, and the adrenylin is released, it might make your heart beat faster, or your palms sweat, or make you feel like you can't swallow or your chest gets tight, and that makes us panic more! So, we panic more, and guess what? Our body releases more adrenylin.

The way to combat that cycle is to talk yourself out of releasing any more adrenylin, which in turn will help you to calm down. There is something called "floating" thru a panic attack. When a panic attack comes on, if you can just "float" with it, instead of being scared by it, your body won't release the extra adrenylin, and you will be able to calm yourself.

The way I did this was by first convincing myself that panic could not hurt me. It would not kill me, it would not give me a heart attack, and the way I was feeling was a NATURAL, NORMAL response.

Secondly, I learned some self-talk. "This is a panic attack, that's all it is.", "This will not hurt me". "It will be over soon".

Thirdly, I learned to be ok with my panic, and told people who were with me that I might have one. Just by doing that, I felt 100% more comfortable. They could help me talk my way thru it. And people understood! Even strangers. They might have thought I was weird, but they would have rathered held my hand then watch me freak out. If I am alone, I always try to find a motherly or grandmotherly type to sit with me.

Fourth, I tried Zoloft, which has been a lifesaver, It's very gentle and works great for anxiety. Also, I have some ativan, and I just hold the bottle when I get nervous, and that's what I use as my out if I am trapped in somewhere that I can't get out of. I know I can take the ativan and it will calm me down. I havent had to take one, tho, in over 5 years.

I have to cut this off because my baby is crying and I Have to go pick up my kids, but if you had some pinpointed questions, maybe I could try and answer those! I don't want to bore you with my stuff if I'm not on the right track!!

[mana]

Thank you so much for all your replies. Short flights seem to pass so quickly. With long flights as someone mentioned, you have more time for your mind to wander. I'm also afraid of hitting more turbulence and so on. I'm curious whether there is less turbulence in the Summer months.

I'm flying to Chicago and I flew there last year and had a really bad panic attack on the plane and couldn't fly for a while after that. Thanks chdsgrl for describing what you go through with the panic attacks, it's the most miserable feeling and I'm afraid of going through it again. So far this year, I've flown a 1, 2 and 3 hour flight. Had some anxiety but took medication on the flight and that calmed me down. So I guess I'm just really anxious of this flight to the point of thinking of backing out.

Thanks again.

[chdsgrl]

You shouldn't back out just because of the fear of having a panic attack. They're completely controllable. What are your symptoms when you have one? Once we determine that, we can work on how you can get a handle on it.

[aerobat]

just a quickie to Mana and Diana...



Mana, it is so very important to not back out of that flight to Chicago. When we do that (believe me, I have done it!) we hand over more power to our fear, and it becomes that much harder to get on the plane the next time. It's a straight road to total groundedness. Please don't take that road. There are so many resources available here for getting a handle on your fear, and on a panic attack, should it happen. Diana really knows what she is talking about, and beaugest (Monica) is a professional therapist. Everything you need is available right here.

Diana, I just want to say how impressed I am with not only your knowledge but your ability to be a pillar of strength to the new people here!! You are more ready than you know for the flight that just might change how you feel about flying!
Barb

[PositiveE]

Your post made me think of a question. First of all, I'm glad to say that I have never actually cancelled a flight or didn't get on the plane.

But which is worse, taking the flight and having multiple panic attacks which sensitizes us to associating panic with flying or not flying at all?

I know we're veering off the path of Mana's original question, but what do you think?

[chdsgrl]

I think if you're prone to panic attacks, you're going to have to deal with them even outside of flying. If you only have panic attacks on a plane, that doesn't mean that if you don't get a handle on it, that somewhere down the road it could raise it's ugly head while you're doing something else.

I know for me, that once I learned the breathing techniques, and the relaxation techniques AND the self talk, I no longer worried about the sensations of a panic attack. I accepted the fact that I was going to have one, but I knew when it did happen how to deal with it, and how to make it stop before it got out of hand.

Also, I think I have wrapped up alot of my anxieties into flying. I think I subconciously did that because I thought I would never have to fly, therefore I would never have to deal with all the "stuff" I was putting there. So, flying for me will give me a sense of impowerment that I really need. I know I am going to be scared, I know I probably will have a panic attack, but I know when it's over, it will be David Vs Goliath all over again, and I will have won.

So, to answer your question, for me facing my fear and the panic and knowing I can do it, will in turn de-associate panic to flying, and I will be better off than never doing it and possibly missing out on some really great trips.

[PositiveE]

Also, I think I have wrapped up alot of my anxieties into flying. I think I subconciously did that because I thought I would never have to fly, therefore I would never have to deal with all the "stuff" I was putting there. So, flying for me will give me a sense of impowerment that I really need.



Wow, Diana I can really relate to this. I think I've also wrapped up a lot of my anxieties in flying too. Even my fear of getting married. :shocked:

[chdsgrl]

Wow, Diana I can really relate to this. I think I've also wrapped up a lot of my anxieties in flying too. Even my fear of getting married. :shocked:

***

I went on a field trip the other day with my daughter to one of the California Missions. We had to sit in the church for about 45 minutes and listen to a lecture and even then I was feeling claustrophobic and I could have gotten out if I wanted to! But, I had made the decision prior to going that it was important for me to stay (for my daughter's sake) and I did, and it turned out great.

I also had a MAJOR panic attack when I was a bridesmaid in a wedding. Major Major and I almost bolted. Then I thought the bride would have my head so I talked my way down, and made it through.

Sometimes, even when we are faced with really uncomfortable situations, we can manage our way through them. We just have to make a committment to ourselves to do it.

What's your fear about getting married?

[jazzy]

It's so wierd how you read stuff on here and can relate to it sooo much. It's so nice that other people share these feelings, I used to feel like i was so different having these feelings that i didn't want to tell anyone about them fearing that would think i'm insane. I too was in a wedding party and had a panic attack and wanted to bolt, then you start panicking more when you think how you would ruin you poor friends wedding and everyone would be staring at you.:mg:

[PositiveE]

Diana - I started a different thread to answer your question.

[aerobat]

Your post made me think of a question. First of all, I'm glad to say that I have never actually cancelled a flight or didn't get on the plane.

But which is worse, taking the flight and having multiple panic attacks which sensitizes us to associating panic with flying or not flying at all?

I know we're veering off the path of Mana's original question, but what do you think?

Hi, Pos,

My two cents, as a non-shrink who has thought a lot about these things...

If a person who has panic attacks has not begun to learn about anxiety, I would think that multiple panic attacks on airplanes would very soon lead to not flying at all. The end result would be the same.

Panic attacks are awful (I know this from personal experience), and in the absence of a matrix of knowledge and support concerning them, it's hard for me to imagine anyone just continuing to tough them out. Might as well try to battle the Borg with a water pistol.

But once someone has started learning about the monster, everything changes. Not often dramatically and not necessarily on the surface at first...but the overall trend goes from (A) flights getting worse and worse to (B) flights NOT getting worse and probably starting to get better.

This is why I would suggest to anyone who comes here that they not cancel.

That they are here is proof that they have made a decision to become better fliers by getting knowledge and support, and the longer they stay with us, the more confident about that decision they are likely to become. Each flight can now feed into a new paradigm of confidence...even when the flights are still on the rocky side emotionally.

I say this as one who let myself slide into 13 years of groundedness in the absence of knowledge and support. I was so clueless! I was no coward, either...I was a professional cave explorer during those years, but totally buffaloed by my fears (anticipatory anxiety especially) about flying.

This phobia is a neurochemical accident, and without the proper "antidotes" we can't turn off the flood of fear hormones. But once we learn to start doing that, and we combine that skill with some aviation education to understand the very small risk in flying...we can change everything.

The courage to fly is immediately rewarded with personal accomplishment and satisfaction, and that in turn becomes power to keep flying and keep getting better at it, and keep being rewarded for doing it. Whatever ups and downs we may encounter, the big picture is...we get better. :thumbsup:

Barb

[kallieb]

Hi Barb,

Well said, in terms of how conquering fear is a process that happens in stages; and how important it is for all of us to realize that this work is not just a 'one shot deal' ala if I can make the first flight feel good then all flights will feel good.

This is a big step I have recently come to finally accept. As much as I want a 'grand single moment' where this all goes away, I now know that I will fly with varying degrees of fear and discomfort for a while, and that it will diminish over time. How quickly and to what extent is up to me and the work I do on myself.

I've noticed a trend in some recent posts, where huge disappointment is felt by some members because their second flight felt so awful compared to their first flight feeling so great. The inherent expectation/beleif seemed to be that the first time must be a fluke because the trip home felt like crap again; therefore there is no hope of change.

So, thanks again for saying so well how the process of change must be in a realistic context but it IS absolutely doable!

[chdsgrl]

I think if it's your first panic attack or your hundreth, the symptoms are generally the same, and working through those symptoms are usually the same as well, with breathing techniques, self talk, etc. If panic is only set-off by FoF, there are medications that can help, just the same if the panic is set off somewhere else. But, the most desireable way to deal with panic is by educating yourself, understanding it, and then dealing with it head on. The terror of panic isn't lessened if you have a history of it.

[aerobat]

I would also like to clarify something, in support of Monica's position that people who have panic attacks and people with "simple" FoF really fall into different categories in terms of anxiety classification.

I did say that I have experienced panic attacks...but not on an airplane. I had my first panic attack ever watching a very disturbing film about the Holocaust in--I think--1966; I must have been in an extremely vulnerable state, because in the middle of the movie I felt so freaked by its content that I just had to get up and run out and leave my friends behind. I had all the physical symptoms of a panic attack, but at the time had no idea what was happening to me. The second time was on the morning of my scheduled flight from Lima, Peru to Guayaquil, Ecuador in March, 1980--the first leg of my journey home to the US after being away for two years. I could not get on the plane; I bailed and went overland (horrendous adventure). But I am not a classic "panic person" and my fear of flying was definitely a mainstream 'specific phobia' restricted to flying.

I still feel that, regardless of which side of this "fence" we are on...if we can get the info and support necessary to keep flying, then we should do our best to board the plane and at least not lose out on all the advantages of flying. My list of things lost over 30 years is a long and sad one, if I were to dwell on it. Given what help there is for this constellation of fears, there is every reason for courage and optimism. And I also agree that if we do bail, there is still every reason for courage and optimism, and no reason for shame.

Barb